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dead nodes


Mib

Question

I have a problem with dead nodes. They follow me through every software version. Now I run on 4.058 Beta.

I tried the mesh network reconfiguration. I get tihs result:

 

[09:00:50] 476: Requesting neighbor list from the node is in progress
[09:01:10] 476: Getting new neighbor list failed

 

So what does it tell me? What can I do to solve this prob?

Thanks

MIB

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petergebruers, any chance that you have a device in network in test range mode? This can be very stressful for Z-Wave network.

Please check that

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One more test after that, please try to control one of the dead nodes manually - by pressing a button or forcing a report. HC2 should wake the device up automatically. If not this will mean that not only HC2 cannot reach a node but it is like this both ways.

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petergebruers, any chance that you have a device in network in test range mode? This can be very stressful for Z-Wave network.

Please check that

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One more test after that, please try to control one of the dead nodes manually - by pressing a button or forcing a report. HC2 should wake the device up automatically. If not this will mean that not only HC2 cannot reach a node but it is like this both ways.

I understand that the "test range mode" bombards the Z-Wave network. The dead nodes appeared during normal operation, last night.

I already clicked several times on all dead nodes. Some work, some don't. For instance, My LC12 stay dead. My main RGW is dead and can't be controlled, I'll double check the power supply. I've powered down the house.

I've done a full mesh reorganize, nowe one of my FGWP responds faster to clicks, but the HC2 displays: "0 Watt". Another wall plug, 3 m from HC2, can switch on, but then HC2 says: "transfer failed".

At the moment, I've a FGWP freshly included and the probe is OK. If I move it to another place, 5 m away from HC2, it probes "yellow". Still a bit further... "red". Even when I reorganize closer to the target location. I did not have dead nodes (the ones that where powered I mean) before yesterday, nothing should probe "red".

I know this is highly unscientific, but it feels the way Mib put it: Z-Wave mesh routing is not working. Either it is not working, or traffic is keeping it so busy that nothing seems to work...

I think I don't have the right diagnostic tools to fix this.

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What is device id 476? And can I guess it might be one of the furthest devices from your controller?

Did you mean to say: "device id 4096"? That's a temporary device ID assigned by the HC2 during reconfiguration, it is not a real ID. The device in case has ID 1000-something and it is less than 3m (without obstacles) away from HC2.

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Everyone struggling faulty mesh rebootvthen full mesh repair again... Better results!

I was typing my reply while you wrote this. I've initiated a full repair 1/2 hour ago, before your post, so it has done a large part of my powered devices. I'd say it's better, but it's to early to say everything will be OK. I've still got dead nodes and delays right now.

Why was everything fine yesterday (before and after the update to 4.059) , but not today? Does the HC2 run a kind of mesh maintenance during the night? I understand the "nearest neighbor" principle, but what I don't know is if a controller can change (set, force) the routing of a device?

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Sorry this is not my thread but I'd thought I'd mention it here because I see some similarities. The mesh update did not result in a further improvement. Some nodes are dead and can't be controlled. Other nodes are dead, but sometimes respond to on/off commands. I'm trying include/exclude but that doesn't work for my wall mounted modules. I'm running out of ideas. Time for a (late) spring cleaning? Exclude everything and reset?

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I'm going for the spring cleaning. What I've noticed after a few devices, is this: I can't exclude them when the HC2 is at 7 m away, but it does work at 3 m. Possible explanations? A lot of noise on the Z-Wave channel, a rogue device that keeps transmitting, a bug in the firmware, database corruption, roblems on the tx/rx side of the HC2. I'm now going to do the other 80 modules.

This is weird. When I try to exclude my minimote, I get "Device was deleted succesfully" and "Learning mode error. Try again.". It doesn't exclude...

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Changes given in 4.059 unfortunately cannot bring any issues to Neighbour update feature - it is a protocol thing, we do not force routing rules for any device. We can only request neighbour update for specific device or whole network - this is working as it is and we cannot change that.

 

I think (but cannot be sure) that this is traffic related issue.

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Changes given in 4.059 unfortunately cannot bring any issues to Neighbour update feature - it is a protocol thing, we do not force routing rules for any device. We can only request neighbour update for specific device or whole network - this is working as it is and we cannot change that.

 

I think (but cannot be sure) that this is traffic related issue.

Good to see that confirmed. So clearly, if a device has trouble communicating, it might improve if you can perform a "update nearest neighbor" on that device (and the devices between HC2 and dead device). The catch-22 is that you connect get that command accross a failing network.

Maybe my HC2 broke down? I didn't change devices or scenes.

I have tried to get my HC2 closer to the failed nodes, and I was able to successfully perform a neighbor update. But overall, I don't seem to gain much from that. Of course, the in between nodes might be the problem, but how can I find out?

I am now excluding all devices. I've noticed this: the device has to be really close to the HC2 for the exclusion to work. Last case was a FGS-221. It didn't exclude at 5 m from HC2. So I brought the HC2 closer, and 3 m it still didn't work. Now at 150 cm I was finally able to exclude that relay. Possible explanations? A lot of noise on the Z-Wave channel, a rogue device that keeps transmitting, a bug in the firmware, database corruption, problems on the tx/rx side of the HC2.

Can I learn something from this observation?

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  • Inquirer
  • I just install the update. Do not think it can get worse in my case. By the way do we get now only Beta updates? Are there no new stable Version around anymore?

    The contact to the support is frustrating!

     

    Support

    Hello,
    Please answer/check the following:
    1) please check the battery powered devices, and make sure the batteries are OK.
    2) are there any unassigned devices ?
    3) how far from the controller are the dead devices ?
    4) what materials are used in the building (possible interference)
    5) please make sure all the antennas are not shorten or cut
    6) please check also antennas in HC
    Please increase the frequency of reports, turn off the polling interval
    Kind regards

     

     

     

    Me

    1) Batteries are ok
    2) No unassigned devices
    3) Sometimes 2 meters sometimes basement or upper floor
    4) Concrete in basement rest 25cm bricks
    5) Antennas are ok – I already checked them (by the way one day module is working one not)
    6) I took it apart to check it. For me it seems ok.
    7) “turn off the polling interval” :
    Do you mean polling dead devices?
    How do I increase the frequency of reports?

    Support

    Hello,
    Yes, I mean polling dead device – should be unchecked
    Frequency of reports You can change by increase the value for: “Devices polling time interval”
    Regards

     

    Me

    Hello!
    I unchecked the polling dead device.
    I increased the value from suggested 440 to 1000.
    Any other helpful suggestions?

     

    Support

    Thats all.
    In case of any problem please contact again.
    Regards

    Me

    Are you kidding?

    I still have dead nodes! And not working switches!

    I want to solve this problem!

     

     

     

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    For what it is worth, I would have answered almost the same. Frequency of reporting hasn't changed (they mean: check parameters related to reporting of power, temperature and luminance per device). Global polling is at 600 and has been so for weeks. All my Danfoss LC12 valves are dead, regardless of distance. These valves like to have a direct connection. Conclusion?

    I'd almost say... Output power of the HC2 transmitter has dropped? But that seems odd.

    Traffic? Possible enough, but how to diagnose?

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    The most reliable way to check that is to open device logs, support can do it -> please open a case with information that QA suggested this procedure.

     

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    The most reliable way to check that is to open device logs, support can do it -> please open a case with information that QA suggested this procedure.

    Thanks, but now you underestimate me... I did that at 09:02. Got: "Case Notification for #35443"

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    While I'm waiting for an answer, I keep removing devices... It feels so... "liberating".

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  • Inquirer
  • @

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    :

    So you exclude the modules one by one? All of your devices?

    What do you expect from this?

     

    MIB

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    Good question, indeed! I would like to see how my HC2 performs with only ONE device, then TWO devices, to test the routing. As long as I have any devices enabled on my network, I cannot know for sure that the network is quiet. So the only way to do that is by removing all devices.

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  • Inquirer
  • why not trying another location where no devices are installed? Just take one with you and check if it works.

    By the way how many devices do you have in use? How big is your location?

    If I would exclude all devices (ca. 100) it would take me days to re-include them. Take all switches apart, take the devices out to press the B button, move the HC2 to the particular module to be within including range. All of the scripting is lost then.

    This is a nightmare!

     

    MIB

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    I have 80+ devices, most of them installed in a volume 11 x 10 x 6 m. Plus some outdoors. It's a small house. You can still "operate" everything by pushing some buttons.

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    Testing HC2 + one device at a different location would certainly be interesting. I took an alternative approach, partly because I have been toying with this idea. And also because I reasoned it might be one of the devices. No strong arguments, following my intuition so to speak.

    Fibaro dimmers and relays can be excluded by 3-click S1, no need to remove them. I have a few RGBW and UBS that need to be "dug out".

    All my scripting is exported (I wrote a program to do that. But you can use Krikroff's toolkit). It will still be a while, yes, absolutely. Let's say... I've got nothing better to do right now.

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  • Inquirer
  • I missed that possibility to operate every device with a button ... water pump for pond, thermometer for the pond, pond lights, ventilation, ... 

    March 2015 I did a total new begin. But at those days I had just a couple of devices. Now I do not want to do tis again.

    But I have  a feeling the day will come.

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    The QA department was able to do a quick checkup. It seems the log files contain almost no received data, pointing somewhat in the direction of a hardware problem. It's unlikely that no data enters the system. And if the controller doesn't receive "acknowledge" packets it will mark nodes dead... Next step? I am waiting for the guys from support.

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    The most reliable way to check that is to open device logs, support can do it -> please open a case with information that QA suggested this procedure.

    Support only? This is why you guys suffer so much! This needs to be information supplied in interface e!

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