Danfoss Z-Wave 014G0013 + Danfoss RS 014G0160

[kudl4t4 0]

I have Danfoss 014G0013 and RS 014G0160 in my room. 

Do you know how to set them up in Home Center 2, so the Heating Panel would work with them?

Right now it seems, whatever is set, they just block the valve. 

 

Thanks!

[pos 22]

I would like to know that too

[pos 22]

Any work on this from Fibaro? Or do they only care for their own new thermostats?

 

The Danfoss RS problem has been a reality for quite some time now..

 

What about 4.141 ?

 

 

[Lauri 6]

Danfoss works but you need LUA to use it with Home Center like you want to.. Biggest problem with RS is that it doesnt have association groups... very bad move from danfoss.

[pos 22]

 

I now know it cannot work as expected. With that I mean that RS can only be used to send a new setpoint to the thermostat.

 

The thermostat however will _always_ open and close its valve based on the local temp sensor in the thermostat. I.e the thermostat cannot with std open Z-wave firmware use an external sensor like RS for that. LUA cannot help you... To regulate the thermostat based on an external temp sensor like RS, you need firmware (i.e 3.0.2) in the Danfoss thermostats that will cause it to no longer work with open Z-wave systems like HC2, but with Danfoss closed Z-wave only.

 

To just read temp from RS and send set points to the thermostat however, LUA works perfectly fine. But the RS is not a part of the real temp regulation in the room. Well, it is. But if the RS see it is 19° in the room and sets 21° in the thermostat, it is not for sure you have 21° in the room later, only close to the radiator. So you could potentially have a temp in the room showed in the RS of 19°, but the but the RS set point for the thermostat of 21° and the system is in sync. This as  the thermostat measure at the radiator anyway.

 

The RS give you:

The temp at the place where you have the RS

The possibility to adjust the thermostat from the wall instead of go to the radiator.

 

The RS WONT:

Act as an external sensor for the thermostat

 

Regards

/Peo

[jakub.jezek 350]

With Lua you can copy Target level from Danfoss RS (thermostat part) to target level setpoint of Danfoss LC-13. And as Trigger it would be Danfoss RS value.

 

But CON is, that Danfoss RSs and neither Danfoss LC-13s are not FLIR, so they could be probably up to 15 - 20 min (in default settings), to set temperature.

[pos 22]

I use LUA with RS already. But that wont solve what I want to accomplish as I said above. RS is meaningless if it cannot be used as an external sensor to a Danfoss Living Connect thermostat. RS only solves that you do not have to go to the radiator and push the buttons on the LC. To just show room temp you could use any temp sensor. RS has a real purpose in a pure Danfoss proprietary z-wave system. There an RS can handle multiple Living Connect radiator valves in a room synchronously based on the temp sensor in the RS where the temp sensor in the LCs itself is put aside.

[jakub.jezek 350]

Hi @pos,

 

I will try to describe something aboud Danfoss, that i leaned some time ago from phone call from Account manager in Danfoss Czech republic. And i believe it is still actual.

 

Danfoss RS in Danfoss Enviroment system sends temperature to Danfoss gateway where is something like Heating panel (more advanced than Fibaro one), which controls Danfoss TRVs in particular zone. So still, you have temperature sensor, with fancy remote control on the wall. It is faster, because it is just Danfoss products there and that system is morelikely "custom made".

 

So back to Fibaro system. It is the same without main thermostat getting control like Danfoss enviroment, if heating panel is used. However in Fibaro enviroment there is better interoperability (Thermostat from different manufacturers gets same setpoint and are controlled by temp. sensor we choose), because it is standard Z-Wave protocol and not changed Z-Wave, like in Danfoss case.

 

If you want samething, that has direct control with temperature sensor and not through gateway. Look at Fibaro heat controller. It connects to it's temperature sensor via Bluetooth and sending that temperature to Fibaro HC2/HCL via Z-Wave.

[pos 22]

7 hours ago, jakub.jezek said:

Hi @pos,

 

I will try to describe something aboud Danfoss, that i leaned some time ago from phone call from Account manager in Danfoss Czech republic. And i believe it is still actual.

 

Danfoss RS in Danfoss Enviroment system sends temperature to Danfoss gateway where is something like Heating panel (more advanced than Fibaro one), which controls Danfoss TRVs in particular zone. So still, you have temperature sensor, with fancy remote control on the wall. It is faster, because it is just Danfoss products there and that system is morelikely "custom made".

 

Yes, you can as I said ONLY send set point to the radiator valve based on the RS (which make it a dummy remote to save a few foot steps going to the radiator). The radiator thermostat will close the valve when the radiator thermostat internal temp sensor has reached the set point, not when the RS room value is met. 

 

If we want to close the radiator valve when the RS temp sensor value on the wall is met, that is correct for the Danfoss closed Zwave with proprietary firmware in the radiator thermostats. With that setup, the radiator thermostat will put its own temp sensor aside and regulate the valve against the RS temp sensor.

 

 

Quote

 

So back to Fibaro system. It is the same without main thermostat getting control like Danfoss enviroment, if heating panel is used. However in Fibaro enviroment there is better interoperability (Thermostat from different manufacturers gets same setpoint and are controlled by temp. sensor we choose), because it is standard Z-Wave protocol and not changed Z-Wave, like in Danfoss case.

 

If you want samething, that has direct control with temperature sensor and not through gateway. Look at Fibaro heat controller. It connects to it's temperature sensor via Bluetooth and sending that temperature to Fibaro HC2/HCL via Z-Wave.

 

A fibaro heat controller maybe have this functionality. But Danfoss are real pro:s in this area. It requires a lot before I will  switch to Fibaro thermostats. Also, we do not know anything about the hardware and software quality yet as it is so new. I only need what I described above for *one* room. I was forced to rebuild the kitchen with floor heating instead of std radiators. Because of that,  the floor heating thermostat is now sitting in a cup board and therfor only can feel the temp inside that cup board. That is why I need the radiator thermostat valve to work against a remote sensor.

 

 

I have two options here as far as I can see.

 

# 1

Save the Danfoss Link system with just one RS and one Living Connect for the kitchen and move everyting else over to the fibaro system.

(Yes I have a Danfoss system today in parallell to my Fibaro HC2, But I want to be FREE! If possible.....)

 

# 2

Buy and try the new Fibaro thermostat with the heat sensor in the kitchen and use Danfoss in all other rooms. Then I can move everything over to my Fibaro HC2.

 

 

/Peo

 

Edited November 16, 2017 by pos

[jakub.jezek 350]

Hi @pos,

 

On 16. 11. 2017 at 11:10 AM, pos said:

There an RS can handle multiple Living Connect radiator valves in a room synchronously based on the temp sensor in the RS where the temp sensor in the LCs itself is put aside.

I carefully looked into this. Now, if you want to Danfoss RS have direct connection to Danfoss TRVs on a standard Z-Wave level, then you will have to contact Danfoss via this feature request. Because in this state Z-Wave version cannot do that. Even Fibaro cannot make this (@T.Konopka, please correct me if i'm wrong, but i think i'm not).

 

Also i believe, that even in Danfoss Link, there is no direct connection between RS and TRV. It would only increase battery consumtion. If there is setting of it (direct connection). Please, can you post here a screenshot of such setting?

 

 

 

 

[pos 22]

Yes. According to my Danfoss contact, you are correct in that there are no direct connection between RS and TRV in a Danfoss Link setup. According to them the communication goes over the Danfoss Link. But still, the RS temp sensor is used for TRV regulation instead of the built it temp sensor i the Living connect thermostat. So.. using Danfoss RS without the Danfoss proprietary Zwave is only a v*e*r*y expensive set point changer to the radiator thermostat as the RS temp sensor is not use for the TRV valve regulation. That's all.

 

I assume the new Fibaro thermostat can have the same functionality adding the externa sensor. Right?

[jakub.jezek 350]

Yes, i believe Fibaro TRV has same functionality, but there is direct connection between TRV and Sensor.