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New Energy Pannel - explanations please


Momos
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32 minutes ago, Momos said:

If the input data from a json is instant power consumed or produced, com.fibaro.energyMeter can not be used to calculate the "energy" as it will break the Energy Pannel to the point that it needs Fibaro support to fix it.


This only makes a conflict and actually does not hurt other calculations (only in case if this energyMeter is selected as poduction it will result in balance = 0).
The issue with not calculating summary consumption in your case was actually related to something else - as main meter not existing device was set :)

 

34 minutes ago, Momos said:

 

All works good in the Energy pannel with the exception of production - as i understood it is a bug that will be fixed in the next version.


Production calculation does not work if main energy meters is set - this will be fixed and released as soon as possible.

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something seems to be still somehow broken, empty Yubii, one QA with power and virtualEnergyConsumption, 50kW as power property when it's on and 0W when it's off. Clicked few times on/off, to get some reading - energy panel shows these small changes

 

Please login or register to see this image.

/monthly_2021_08/image.png.32549ee8c4a7bf90f5a4eccfd0a9acea.png" />

 

then started with scene, to run for 30mins. 

 

Energy panel remains the same after 30min (and after device goes off) - so i miss 25kWh, the device irelf shows proper total comsumption

 

image.png.76858c6ee1835536e7eb83acea7f9b93.png

 

so it definitely make sense, for devices with static consumption, to randomize it (like between 99.99 and 100%), before one write the power value.

I know @m.roszak that you said "only when value changing, it will be written", however, the device has the data, only energy panel shows wrong values without randomizing.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by tinman
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Calculation is being performed once per 15 minutes im virtualEnergyConsumption im case when the state of the device does not change.

Additionally there are some additional safety measures to drop too high deltas between reports (more than 5kWh in case of energy interface is being dropped).

Those are implelented due problems with some old zwave modules which may report very high unexpected values (reported by some users during beta-tests).

 

As energy interface is designed for actors we do not expect this high load there. 

Do, if device have power declared as >20kW (more than 5kWh per 15 minutes) it won't be included in calculations.

 

com.fibaro.energyMeter also have similiar redundancy but maximum delta is set as 15kWh.

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Hello,

 

On my panel, rather than seeing the name of the devices, I see numbers:

 

 

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Why is that ? 63.0 and 53.0 instead of "blind xxx / light yyy" ?

 

Maybe I did not hide/show the correct child/parent for my device (I am completely newbie, forgive me if I am not posting at the correct place).
And in such case, how do you decide which device to hide or show ?
In my case for #53.0:

 

Please login or register to see this image.

/monthly_2021_08/image.png.074532c51e64fa9dfa893390d9b14418.png" />

 

image.png.f8dad3bd697b9acd4c8c51d91503172b.png

Thanks,

Fly

 

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On 8/6/2021 at 9:49 AM, m.roszak said:

As energy interface is designed for actors we do not expect this high load there. 

Do, if device have power declared as >20kW (more than 5kWh per 15 minutes) it won't be included in calculations.

 

com.fibaro.energyMeter also have similiar redundancy but maximum delta is set as 15kWh.

 

you might wonder were i got such high loads, actually TUYA 3x80A circuit breaker with power measurment (TUYA have some up to 3x125A), which i read via QuickApp.

It would be nice to have option to set own max "ignore" value (somewhere in energy panel), please take in count that some customers might use the HC3 to control external non-zwave devices.

Edited by tinman
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12 hours ago, tinman said:

 

you might wonder were i got such high loads, actually TUYA 3x80A circuit breaker with power measurment (TUYA have some up to 3x125A), which i read via QuickApp.

It would be nice to have option to set own max "ignore" value (somewhere in energy panel), please take in count that some customers might use the HC3 to control external non-zwave devices.

Also Aeotec HEM-3 Gen5 have version with 100A and 200A clamps, and we sell them to projects

So, I'm agree with @tinman - it's better to have option to set own max "ignore" value by user

 

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On 8/13/2021 at 11:09 PM, tinman said:

you might wonder were i got such high loads, actually TUYA 3x80A circuit breaker with power measurment (TUYA have some up to 3x125A), which i read via QuickApp.

It would be nice to have option to set own max "ignore" value (somewhere in energy panel), please take in count that some customers might use the HC3 to control external non-zwave devices.

 

On 8/14/2021 at 11:59 AM, afendikov said:

Also Aeotec HEM-3 Gen5 have version with 100A and 200A clamps, and we sell them to projects

So, I'm agree with @tinman - it's better to have option to set own max "ignore" value by user


I understand your point of view - in most cases even in high load devices reports will be more frequently with smaller deltas than 5kWh/15kWh.

Anyway - I will request a feature to add this as a configuration variable in devices, then every user will be able to fine tune this safety measure for their own needs. 

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I have some questions about the new Energy Panel en device types.

 

I am changing my P1 Monitor QuickApp to support the new Energy Panel. I am making progress, but I think I still have some choices to make. I hope I can get some answers here. 

 

These are the (child) devices the QuickApp has. 

 

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The child devices "Consumption High", "Consumption Low", "Production High" and 'Production Low" are all (kWh) the type com.fibaro.energyMeter, so the Energy Panel can show the total consumption and production. That works ok. 

 

The child devices "Consumption" and "Production" are (Watt) the type com.fibaro.powerSensor. I put the measurements in the "value" and "power". I can see the power consumption chart working ok.  

 

Questions:

- Should I make the child devices "Consumption L1" and L2 and L3 and "Production L1" and L2 and L3 also (Watt) the type com.fibaro.powerSensor ?

- The Main Devices P1 Monitor can be positive or negative in Watt. To select the Main Devices P1 Monitor as "Main Energy Meter", should is be the type type com.fibaro.powerSensor or com.fibaro.energyMeter ? Or should it be the type com.fibaro.powerMeter, but you can't select that one when creating the QuickApp?


 

 

 

Edited by SmartHomeEddy
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3 hours ago, SmartHomeEddy said:

Questions:

- Should I make the child devices "Consumption L1" and L2 and L3 and "Production L1" and L2 and L3 also (Watt) the type com.fibaro.powerSensor ?

- The Main Devices P1 Monitor can be positive or negative in Watt. To select the Main Devices P1 Monitor as "Main Energy Meter", should is be the type type com.fibaro.powerSensor or com.fibaro.energyMeter ? Or should it be the type com.fibaro.powerMeter, but you can't select that one when creating the QuickApp?


ad1.
com.fibaro.powerSensor and putting Watts in "value" will allow you to see graphs in device settings. No need to add "power" interface and updating its property.

ad2.
only com.fibaro.energyMeter is selectable as main sensor, in "value" property put energy increment (kWh).
Watts are not used by the panel.
Main energy meter should be a consumption device, summary production is just a sum of all devices with rateType == production.

You can alter the type of the QA to a different type (not selectable in the web ui) by simple edit of QA file downloaded from Gateway :)
New types will be added to UI in one of next versions.

Regards,
Michał 

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Thanks Michał

 

I will change the Consumption L1" and L2 and L3 and "Production L1" and L2 and L3 also (Watt) to com.fibaro.powerSensor, so the users of the QuickApp can enjoy the power graphs. I will look into the power value. I couldn't see the values in the graphs, until I put the values in "power". At least, that is what I saw in the test. I will try it without the "power" value. 

 

I put the consumption and production kWh in de energy panel, with the appropriate device type and rateType. That works ok. 

 

Please login or register to see this attachment.

 

 

If I want to be able to select one of the (child) devices in the main energy meter, I should use the energyMeter type and only put the energy usage, consumption, in the value (kWh), so no deduction of the production measurements?

(That could make the value negative)

 

It will show up in the App here?

Please login or register to see this image.

/monthly_2021_08/image.png.07d12ddc063eeb1e7cbb3962b20b1f10.png" />

 

 

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7 minutes ago, SmartHomeEddy said:

If I want to be able to select one of the (child) devices in the main energy meter, I should use the energyMeter type and only put the energy usage, consumption, in the value (kWh), so no deduction of the production measurements?

(That could make the value negative)

 

It will show up in the App here?


Main meter -> consumption. Yeah :)
This is designed that way because you can have a lot of devices with power consumption measurements but with production it is easier - normally there will be one or two devices which reports summary energy production so we just sum this up automatically.

Negative power values (Watts) should be visible in the app but I am not sure what will happen with the graphs. 
The better implementation will be to use absolute value of the reported power:
- create two com.fibaro.powerMeter's (one production, one consumption) - not available now from UI and does not show the graphs - this will be added in one of next versions.
- update production one with abs(negative power measurement), if reported power is positive then set here 0W.

- update consumption one with abs(positive power measurement), if reported power is negative then set here 0W. 

For now you can of course use com.fibaro.powerSensor's (to get the graphs) instead but there is no rateType property there so just name them to easily difference production from consumption.
 

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27 minutes ago, m.roszak said:

Negative power values (Watts) should be visible in the app but I am not sure what will happen with the graphs. 

 

The graphs handle it well, sort of 😄

 

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/monthly_2021_08/image.png.6f6d8dac2e76936bb5971119b7f0752e.png" />

 

 

 

36 minutes ago, m.roszak said:

- create two com.fibaro.powerMeter's (one production, one consumption) - not available now from UI and does not show the graphs - this will be added in one of next versions.
- update production one with abs(negative power measurement), if reported power is positive then set here 0W.

- update consumption one with abs(positive power measurement), if reported power is negative then set here 0W. 

 

I will, thanks Michał. The current values are already positive, consumption and production, the smart-meter reports them as positive values. And if one of them is has a value >0 the other is zero, so they level out. 

image.png.cad634b7c62ea1851862292068b76606.png

 

 

 

In summary, I will use these these device types:

  • energyMeter for all devices with kWh values
  • powerMeter for all devices with Watt values
  • multilevelSensor for water, ampere, voltage and gas values

 

 

 

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as for water, ampere, voltage and gas values...

I propose:

water -> com.fibaro.waterMeter 
ampere/voltage -> com.fibaro.electricMeter
gas -> com.fibaro.gasMeter

Those also have rateType property so this may be useful. 

Some of this types are new, in the upcoming versions those will probably get some additional features (like graphs :)). 
 

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@m.roszak

I have QA type com.fibaro.colorController with interface power and I do regular update of properties value and power with calculated consumption in Watts -

What I should add to QA to work correctly with new energy panel? Do I need calculate energy and update energy property in kWh?

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com.fibaro.colorController will get virtual energy consumption calculation (from power) like a binary switch or multilevel switch in this version.
For now you need to add interface energy and calculate kWh manually.

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15 hours ago, m.roszak said:

- create two com.fibaro.powerMeter's (one production, one consumption) - not available now from UI and does not show the graphs - this will be added in one of next versions.

 

I cannot see the child devices in the (iOS) app, could the device type com.fibaro.powerMeter of the main device be the cause of that?

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Yep, com.fibaro.*meter's* are not visible in the App in current version - this is on "to do" list. 


* with exception of com.fibaro.energyMeter (this one works)

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Ah, that explains, thanks. I will go for the powerSensor's or multilevelSensor's then, until powerMeter's are supported. Otherwise users won't understand what is going on. I will put it on my toDo list also 😉

 

Is there a next best for?

- devices with power measurement in Watt

- water 
- ampere/voltage 
- gas

 

 

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On 8/23/2021 at 2:33 PM, m.roszak said:

com.fibaro.powerSensor and putting Watts in "value" will allow you to see graphs in device settings. No need to add "power" interface and updating its property.

 

 

Did some testing with my SolarEdge QuickApp, it has com.fibaro.powerSensor for the Main Device and I only update the "value" interface. Without updating the "power" interface, there are no measurement visible in the Power consumption chart. As soon as I also put the current power in the "power" interface, the Power consumption chart shows a "blue dot". 

 

 

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Further testing the new Energy Panel and putting values to it, I see some difference

 

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If I compare the the Consumption value (5.25 kWh) with my other calculations, there is some mismatch. I put the total consumption and total production in the Energy Panel. But all z-wave power measuring send by default there energy usage also to the Energy Panel. 

 

So I have to make a choice, reduce the Consumption of the P1 Monitor with the energy usage of all z-wave power devices before updating the Energy Panel, or turn off the z-wave power devices updating the Energy Panel. 

 

 

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