Binary sensor wiring

[trekker25 0]

Hi all, new to this forum and domotica in general

Ordered 6 fibaro wallplugs and that just was plug &iPlayer:)
Wantend to do more advanced stuff and bought Binary sensor, book electronics for dummies and a breadboard with some components.

Goal: i have a wireless doorbell and want z-wave enable it. The soundunit also has a small led in it and want to put a binary sensor between the led to pick up a signal when the led is lighted.

First wanted to experiment on a breadboard with this project.
1. Got a 9v USB adapter and connected it to the + and - of the UBS. Included it in the z-wave networking and is being recognized.
2. Created a small breadboard project: 9v battery, resistance and a Led.
The led is working when the circuit is connected.

Step 3: combine the steps above and include the UBS in the project. But not sure on the wiring?
My idea was: but the UBS in serie with the circuit just before the Resistance. The led still should be working if wired correctly?
Put the yellow cable of the UBS (IN1) in the breadboard before the resistance and connected a jumper wire to out1 (why are there 2 ports for each OUT) and also put this in the breadboard before the resistance. 

Connected the power but the led doesn't anymore. 

Am I doing something stupid? Just want to pickup the voltage/signal that is running when the circuit is closed...
Hope someone can give some insight in this. 
(And after studying the book I still don't know enough of electronics yet, still doing more breadboard experimenting) 

[j.nowacki 5]

OUT connectors will simply repeat state on the input. So all you need to do is connect whole circuit (power supply, LED, resistor) to the output and put a switch between IN wire and GND signal. When closed, LED should light up. I can draw a quick sketch if you want.

[trekker25 0]

please do.

 

I also will try to make a sketch of my setup as it seems different, but this is in short what i have in mind:

 

I use 2 powersources: a USB adapter for the UBS.  Connected + and - of the adapter to P + GND to give the binary sensor power and is recognized in the z-wave network. Just to give it 24/7 power from the house powering and not need to use batteries.

 

And a second powersource is a 9V battery (to simulate my doorbel; the real doorbell only has 2x 1,5V batteries) attached to a breadboard with just a simple 330 ohm resistor and a LED of 2v 20 mA. It can be used as a seperate LED circuit without the UBS being involved.

 

I connected IN1of the UBS in this battery/LED  circuit before the resistor and the OUT1 also before the resistor. ( trying to make them part of the LED circuit, but having a own power supply from the USB adapter)

I assumed that the IN1 + OUT1 would notice if there would be current flowing from the 9V battery through the circuit and light up the LED.

 

But i guess my way is not correct?

[j.nowacki 5]

Please post an image of what you want to do, I think it will be much faster and we will avoid misunderstanding.

[trekker25 0]

ok let me explain with some pictures.

I have this simple wireless doorbell which i want z-wave enable. I noticed the little LED on top and hoped i could pickup the signal when the LED is being light using a UBS:

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the internal of the doorbell (which is hanging in the hallway):

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the doorbell is powered by 2x 1,5V batteries and last at least 3 years no problem.

I assume the LED is just a 2V 20mA.

My idea is to put the UBS between the powering cables of the LED, but give the UBS a seperate power supply of a 9v USB adapter, as i have read the UBS empties a 9V battery in 2-3 days.

 

This is the UBS connected to the USB power supply:

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Red + Blue connected to the + / - of the USB adapter.

Also connected jumper wires to the IN1 (yellow) and connected a jumper wire to OUT1.

 

I wanted to test this first on a simple breadboard with a LED + toggle switch connected to a 9V battery (resistor has been placed to not blow the LED)

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My question is: how can i connect the UBS in this breadboard project, but give the UBS it's own power supply (9v USB adapter) and not use the 9V battery the LED is using.

 

Is this possible and where should it be wired?

 

I tried putting the IN1 and OUT1 just before the resistor, but the light of LED didn't work, so now current was flowing in this way. Should that work, or is this the wrong way of connecting?

[j.nowacki 5]

OUT connectors are just circuits that repeat state of the input, so by connecting just one of the pair will have no result (it is like a relay with just input connected). I have been playing with electronics only as a hobby so I am no expert, but I would use transistor connected in parallel with LED - NPN will do. Put IN1 on collector and GND on emitter, remember about resistor on a base.

[trekker25 0]

For me also a new starting hobby. So have to read your post at least 10 times tonight when i have more spare time

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[trekker25 0]

OUT connectors are just circuits that repeat state of the input, so by connecting just one of the pair will have no result (it is like a relay with just input connected). I have been playing with electronics only as a hobby so I am no expert, but I would use transistor connected in parallel with LED - NPN will do. Put IN1 on collector and GND on emitter, remember about resistor on a base.

never used a transistor before. Will read the chapter about it in my electronics book.

 

But I have GND already connected to the - of the USB adapter. So how can i connect a emitter to the GND?

 

And about the the IN1 and OUT1;  My idea was that if 9v was running on IN1, it would also be 9V on OUT1? Don't see the real use of the OUTs of the UBS?

 

already thanks for helping me out!

[j.nowacki 5]

OUT are there so you can use the original signal as you would without UBS (so its installation does not affect existing one). They are not connected to anything internally, refer to the manual to see how it is connected internally. GND signal can be connected from the GND wire that is usually used to connect Dallas temperature sensors (there are 2 GND wires).

[trekker25 0]

OUT are there so you can use the original signal as you would without UBS (so its installation does not affect existing one). They are not connected to anything internally, refer to the manual to see how it is connected internally. GND signal can be connected from the GND wire that is usually used to connect Dallas temperature sensors (there are 2 GND wires).

indeed i just noticed the second ground.

 

But if I  just connected IN1 and OUT1 in the circuit as i told, the LED still should be working? That didn't work for me

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Reading now on how to use transistors. But indeed they are binary circuits on it's own, so usable with the UBS.

[trekker25 0]

OUT are there so you can use the original signal as you would without UBS (so its installation does not affect existing one). They are not connected to anything internally, refer to the manual to see how it is connected internally. GND signal can be connected from the GND wire that is usually used to connect Dallas temperature sensors (there are 2 GND wires).

am I correct i can just remove the LED from the project and just put a transistor with the proper wiring in place of it? (with the emitter / collector properly wired?)

 

In the real  doorbell project i don't really need LED, never looked at it

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[j.nowacki 5]

Yes, you can just connect base of the transistor with proper resistor (probably bigger than now), and probably grounds should be connected.

[trekker25 0]

What is the exact use of the resistor and transistor if you already have a toggle switch?

As a toggle switch almost does the same as transistor (creating on/off situation)?

Or am I saying something stupid? (Still reading/experimenting with transistors)

How much voltage can/may the IN1 handle?

[j.nowacki 5]

Your device closes a circuit when there is signal, current flows and diode is lighting up. But to detect change of state on UBS you need to make a short circuit from IN connector to GND. There is voltage on IN1 already (pull-up resistor), breach of this input is detected by connecting it to GND.

[LiG 0]

Hi, 

i'm trying to do the same thing but using a different device instead of doorbell.

 

In the UBS, OUT1 and OUT2 status changes (open/close on contact relay) will due to a variation on respective input CH1 and CH2. 

CH1 modifies his status when yellow wire is connected to GND (blue wire) or when is disconnected from it...so i suppose that if i use a transistor that works in saturation where i connect voltage supply to the Collector, the Emitter to GND, my signal to the Base and i take out the output signal on the Collector node there will be a minimum voltage (~0.2V) between CH1 and GND (Vce voltage) that won't change the UBS state...i should try it...

 

Maybe you could put a relay between Collector node of the transistor and power supply to drive CH1 with a contact...i'm thinking about it...  

[trekker25 0]

Thanks for the Posts! Most still sounds a little gibberish to me. So started from first page in my electronics book again. This time not just reading but also trying to understand each and every word and diagram!

Will keep you updated!

[j.nowacki 5]

I have never use a transistor in such role, hence I am not sure if transistor will do in that role, relay would be of course better, but it is bigger and louder

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