Energy meter

[tnesheim 8]

Hi

I now see that the NorthQ NQ-9021 is supported in HC2 with a template, thanks! The next step should be to include this device in the Energy Panel.

 

The reason for this is that the NQ-9021 can connect to the consumption meter at the electricity main input of the house (or apartment), and will give the total consumption figure of everything.

 

Such a figure is quite difficult to achieve by summing metrics from various actuators(as the system currently can), since many of the electrical appliances cannot (and need not) to be connected to an actuator. Such a device can be the electrical water boiler, floor heating etc. Also, adding energy measuring actuators everywhere is a big and expensive job.

 

So, I think the only way to easy obtain an total consumption figure for the house is to enable the NQ-9021 for the energy panel(which btw looks very good). Going an additional step further the instantaneous power can also be calculated using the kWh-figures enabling the NQ-9021 for the power panel.

 

Fibaro, can you please consider this?

 

 

[XanderF 8]

Maybe the HC2 is not the tool for this. Use a raspberry pi with Domoticz connected to a smart meter P1 port and you'll be able to log everything including gas usage (if connected to the smart meter as well). You could even log water usage if you'd like.

[tnesheim 8]

What I have read the setup you suggest is very capable, also for providing the requested functionality. But I think that HC2 is capable as well, but we rely on Fibaros resource availability to have this implemented. For my part I can probably do what you suggest(by using some/many hours), but I prefer to have this function plug-and-play directly on my HC2.

 

Hopefully Fibaro will se the value in adding the requested features?

[tnesheim 8]

This topic sees not to be as electrifying as I hoped for:-)

 

Fibaro, is this issue on your radar? I think supporting this device will add value to the system, more or less the only way to get total consumption without using the clamp-on devices. Using the NorthQ will utilise the built in energy meters in homes which should be quite accurate and directly related to the electricity bill.

[emielstroeve 22]

Maybe the HC2 is not the tool for this. Use a raspberry pi with Domoticz connected to a smart meter P1 port and you'll be able to log everything including gas usage (if connected to the smart meter as well). You could even log water usage if you'd like.

Hi Xander,

 

How did you get Domoticz (of-topic) working with the P1 meter? I have the Plugwise P1-LAN connector and Domoticz doesn't see (via IP) the plug wise convertor.

 

And after that, Domoticz could sent data to HC2 via Fibarolink (pffff, on-topic again

Please login or register to see this image.

/emoticons/default_icon_wink.gif" alt=";-)" />

 

cheers

emiel

[j.nowacki 5]

So, I think the only way to easy obtain an total consumption figure for the house is to enable the NQ-9021 for the energy panel(which btw looks very good). Going an additional step further the instantaneous power can also be calculated using the kWh-figures enabling the NQ-9021 for the power panel.

 

As far as I remember NQ devices report only energy and not power, right? It will be rather impossible to give reliable value of power since reporting period would affect this. I am not saying it is not technically possible, but for sure readings would be very rough estimation.

[tnesheim 8]

Hello!

Yes, you are right about that, the pulse counting NorthQ in an energy meter. The advantage of this is that there is a one-to-one relation with the house energy meter...and the electricity bill, any other current clamp measurement will deviate by time. As you point out the instantaneous figure of power has to be calculated, hence will only be somewhat accurate based on the fact that the calculation has to be based in the last measurement period, and thereby never a realtime figure. However, the NorthQ can be set up to report energy values quite often every 5s or 10s is feasible. Combining this with a timestamp (os-time?), an average power figure can be calculated. Should the power peak a short time inside this period of eg 10s this will still be captured by the energy meter. Even though this peak value probably never will be displayed, the calculated average power figure of previous period will be accurate(except from the strict real-time aspect). Such a average figure of a short period of 10s will give the user a representative figure of the current power consumption. Also, energy consumption last hour, day and week would be easy using the energy meter. 

 

One should never underestimate the real efforts needed to implement my suggestion(spec, implementation, test etc) but the algorithms required are quite simple and amount of programming efforts required should not be too high?

 

(If I was a programmer I could do this myself i Virtual device/LUA, but the integration in the power/energy panel Fibaro would still have to do).

[j.nowacki 5]

I will pass this as suggestion to this device, but to be honest I have no way to estimate how much effort would it require from software developers.

[tnesheim 8]

Thanks! No problem, most important is that the idea is picked up and passed on for evaluation.

[tnesheim 8]

Hello FIbaro and members.

I have now implemented the NorthQ NQ-9021 as both a power meter and an energy meter. The trick is to make the NQ-9021 send upscaled energy readings as often as possible. I did this by setting parameter 1 to 1000 and parameter, parameter 1 to "pulse" and parameter 8 to 20. The rest of the register should be left alone. Also, press the NQ-9021 button once to enter realtime mode. Why do I do this? My readout period is now 20s and by setting register 1 to 1000 I´m actually able to get a energy reading in such a short period(my house energy meter requires 10000pulses/kWh). The downside is that the device itself is now useless since the value is "scaled" and code has to be generated in a virtual device t display correct values. I have also merged my code with "animated meter" code from this forum:

 

local meterID=156

function getIcon(watt)

  if(watt > 8000) then return 149

  elseif(watt >= 7000) then return 148

  elseif(watt >= 7000) then return 147

  elseif(watt >= 6000) then return 150

  elseif(watt >= 5000) then return 146

  elseif(watt >= 4000) then return 145

  elseif(watt >= 3000) then return 144

  elseif(watt >= 2000) then return 143

  elseif(watt >= 1000) then return 142

  elseif(watt >= 500) then return 141

  else return 141 end

end

 

function round(num, idp)

  local mult = 10^(idp or 0)

  return math.floor(num * mult + 0.5) / mult

end

 

e1=fibaro:getValue(meterID, "value")

t1=os.time()

etot=round(261008 + e1*0.01)

 

while e1==fibaro:getValue(meterID, "value") do end

 

e2=fibaro:getValue(meterID, "value")

t2=os.time()

 

td=t2-t1

ed=(e2-e1)*3.6

p=round(10000*ed/td)

 

fibaro:call(149, "setProperty", "ui.Label1.value", p.." W")

fibaro:call(149, "setProperty", "ui.Label2.value", etot.." kWh")

fibaro:call(149, "setProperty", "currentIcon", getIcon(p))

 

The average calculated power reading(20s periode) is not completely accurate, nor realtime, but its good enough and has lag on 20s only. Peaks will visible, but these figures will be captured and counted contributing to the average power figure. Also, code could be better probably improving accuracy some %. But, the energy readout will be as accurate as possible, and one-to-one with the house energy meter, hence the electricity bill.

 

So Fibaro, if you make it possible to include power/energy from virtual devices into the excellent Fibaro panels it would be perfect solving my initial problem.

[pelle 0]

Interesting topic. Me to would like to see some integration into the Energy Panel. 

 

An alternative option to consider. Perhaps Fibaro could do some really nice and accurate integration if they integrate using the "Meter Table Monitor" Command Class (and "Time Parameters" Command Class for setup of the table monitor). Mentioned command classes are supported according to some NorthQ documentation that I managed to get at some point. I'm not google it any more, but relevant sections look like this:

 

 

5. COMMAND_CLASS_TIME_PARAMETERS

Use this command class to set the Power Reader's real-time clock. The command class is implemented according to the command class specification.

NOTE: The Power Reader will not store any timestamped consumption until the real-time clock is set.

 

 

11. COMMAND_CLASS_METER_TBL_MONITOR

The meter tbl monitor command class is implemented according to the command class specification.

NOTE: The Power Reader will not report any data through this command class if the time parameters are not set.

 

[Maestrea 8]

Why the 10000 factor in this formula?

 

p=round(10000*ed/td)

[tnesheim 8]

Hi

The "multiply by 10000" is an accumulated figure...it consists of correction factors from making the energy meter actually count within a period of approx 20-30s by setting the "pulses/10kWh" to a much lower figure (I use 1000 instead of 100.000) and the conversion kWs to kWh and conversion from kW to W. I can try to walk you through the various steps and put the figures where they really belong in the algorithm, hopefully tonight or tomorrow.