Dimmer with no load

[knuth 29]

My desired setup is as follows: A Dimmer 2 is connected to a single momentary switch. Through this switch I would like to control one channel on a RGBW dimmer for LED strips remotely, through association. A similar solution works fine when there is a separate load on S1 of the dimmer (e.g. downlights), using association on the S2 part of a double switch to associate to the RGBW. (The RGBW in my case is used to control 3 or 4 separate LED strips, one on each channel, each in a different room.The RGBW dimmer itself is centrally located).

 

In this room, however, I have no downlights, hence no primary load for the dimmer. The autocalibration fails and  the dimmer refuses to pass on information through association. The documentation says a minimum 50 W load should be attached (which seems a lot). Here is the question: Will the Dimmer 2 work with only a FGB-002 bypass as a load? 

 

 

[Jamie mccrostie 82]

Yes you will needbypass

[cag014 635]

I don't think bypass will help... I suggest to connect any load (for example regular incandescent light bulb) to perform calibration after that it should work w/o any load.

[Jamie mccrostie 82]

8 hours ago, cag014 said:

I don't think bypass will help... I suggest to connect any load (for example regular incandescent light bulb) to perform calibration after that it should work w/o any load.

Then you get burnt out bulb warnings

Switch 2 instead?

[Barlow 19]

I can confirm that this will work with bypass 2. 

[knuth 29]

@cag014 , I like your idea. Connecting a temporary load like an incandescent bulb will allow configuration and calibration. Disconnecting it later should be no problem. @Jamie mccrostie : Setting parameter 15 to zero will disable the burnt out bulb warning - problem solved! You also suggest using the Switch 2 instead. I have tried that in another room (this time with a load on the Switch), but have trouble assigning an M association to S2 using group 5 (to communicate with the RGBW dimmer function). I was only able to set an S association. The resulting function of the S2 switch is erratic (lights some times do not come on, dimming seldom works, etc.) , while similar setups using the Dimmer and the RGBW work perfectly. 

 

Two of you suggest using the FGB-002 bypass. This seems strange, as the recommended load on the Dimmer is minimum 50 W while the FGB-002 is said to have a power consumption of <1.4 W. If the bypass is the only load, I would have expected the Dimmer to still be unhappy about the lack of a real load. The bypass is supposed to supplement the real load, not replace it, isn't it?

[petergebruers 1,265]

4 hours ago, knuth said:

Two of you suggest using the FGB-002 bypass. This seems strange, as the recommended load on the Dimmer is minimum 50 W while the FGB-002 is said to have a power consumption of <1.4 W. If the bypass is the only load, I would have expected the Dimmer to still be unhappy about the lack of a real load. The bypass is supposed to supplement the real load, not replace it, isn't it?

 

Actually, using the FGB-002, that really is the recommended way. the bypass is not a simple passive component, it is active and makes the dimmer happy while consuming less than about 1 W. Works in 2 or 3 wire setup.

 

Tried and tested...

 

 

4 hours ago, knuth said:

You also suggest using the Switch 2 instead. I have tried that in another room (this time with a load on the Switch), but have trouble assigning an M association to S2 using group 5 (to communicate with the RGBW dimmer function). I was only able to set an S association. The resulting function of the S2 switch is erratic (lights some times do not come on, dimming seldom works, etc.) , while similar setups using the Dimmer and the RGBW work perfectly. 

 

It has been reported before, and it might be a FGS-2x3 bug... Seems it happens when FGS is switching between "routed" and "direct" connection.

 

It works for me, but there is a forum post about "missing Central Scene Event" in certain cases. I cannot find it right now.

Edited January 31, 2019 by petergebruers
Fix partnumber

[cag014 635]

@knuth

You're absolutely correct. Bypass is not a load. Usually you need bypass when your dimmer connected to LED bulb with low consumption.

I quote

The Dimmer Bypass enables the Fibaro Dimmer 2 module to control lamps which have a power of less than 50W. It's ideal for use with low-power LED lamps.

[petergebruers 1,265]

@cag014 we both posted at the same time, please see my previous post...

[Barlow 19]

I suppose you're right that using bypass 2 as the single load is not within specification. However in reality, it works. I have this setup around the house, with Hue GU10 led spots directly constantly powered and Dimmer 2 behind my momentary switches acting as a remote. Using S1 and S2 click and hold to fire scene events against the hue lamps.

[petergebruers 1,265]

OK, I am going to repost my answer because @cag014  and @Barlow seem to have missed it... FGBS-002 is the recommended solution to use Dimmer 2 with no load and FGS-223 is an alternative but might cause issues for some, confirming what @knuth said in a previous post...

 

 

[knuth 29]

OK @petergebruers I get the message: Using the FGB-002 bypass (why do you call it the FGBS-002? That's the binary sensor, isn't it?) actually simulates a load without pulling significant power. That would solve my problem.

 

One question still remains: How and why is this preferable to the other solution? The other solution being to connect a real load (60 W bulb e.g.), install and calibrate, and then disconnect the bulb (while disabling parameter 15 to avoid burnt out bulb warning). Will this jeopardize the life of the Dimmer? This solution avoids the wall box space issue mentioned in another thread.

 

[petergebruers 1,265]

55 minutes ago, knuth said:

why do you call it the FGBS-002

That is a typo indeed. It is the FGB-002. The older FGB-001 does not work with "dimmer 2" and vice versa.

 

57 minutes ago, knuth said:

How and why is this preferable to the other solution? The other solution being to connect a real load (60 W bulb e.g.), install and calibrate, and then disconnect the bulb

If my memory servers me well, your dimmer will not start after a power cut, you'll have to repeat your procedure. And because I have asked Fibaro, the "Bypass 2" was their answer.

[knuth 29]

Two FGB-002 units have been ordered, I expect that to fix the problem. Thanks everyone. I will report back when it has been installed (if I remember...). May take a little while, as this is in my vacation home.

[knuth 29]

As promised, here is a report following installation of bypass FGB-002 in a Dimmer 2, to remotely control a LED strip on one channel of the RGBW controller through association. General conclusion: It works!  On/off/full (double click) work as expected, but I am still not happy with the response on dimming (hold and release momentary switch on Dimmer). It "jumps" from full to zero, and is hard to control smoothly to the desired level. But the basic question posed in this post has been answered: Using the bypass, a Dimmer 2 with no load may control another unit. 

[petergebruers 1,265]

Thank you for reporting back. I avoid associations and I cannot give much advice. Though for dimming it certainly it is an option. The way I work around this is by having a few fixed levels in a scene, and a button (eg on a keyfob) steps through those presets. If you own an FGK-601 you can set it into a special mode to associate eg the + and - for dimming. I tested it a few times but that feature "did not make it into production". Didn't test it on an RGBW  but worked OK on Dimmer 2.

[knuth 29]

I have a KeyFob, still in the box. I will look into your suggestion once it is up and running, but I need to consider that I have 8 different applications of this setup (controlling LED-strips through association to the switch on another device), and need to control them separately.

 

PS: I am happy to have brought you out of semi-retirement