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jwi

Z-Wave Long Range

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That sounds pretty good. 2000 devices per network and a range of 400 meters. Maybe there will be an HC4 in 2 to 3 years.

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3 hours ago, jwi said:

That sounds pretty good. 2000 devices per network and a range of 400 meters. Maybe there will be an HC4 in 2 to 3 years.


then I can service my whole town with one HC4 😃

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8 hours ago, SmartHomeEddy said:


then I can service my whole town with one HC4 😃

Town. not a city ;) 

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  • 18 hours ago, A.Socha said:

    please remember that Zw300 got info about 100m range , zw500 120,, zw700 160m

     

    Yes, those are the  outdoors ranges, but indoors it can be dramatically less with a few

    concrete walls. Or even total connection failure.

    I would be happy if 150 meters of the 400 meters remained. Then my devices

    would all do without hops.

    I think that LR will be realized with the 700 chip. It is possible that the RX/TX performance

    is increased, or more and better antennas, or more frequencies or ???

    In any case, it would have been better if Fibaro had brought out the HC3 with a 700 chip.

    However, this is only my opinion.

     

     

    Edited by jwi

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    38 minut temu, jwi napisał:

    In any case, it would have been better if Fibaro had brought out the HC3 with a 700 chip.

    However, this is only my opinion.

    It was in our plan but zw700 got 1.5 year delay if you gonna check now you will find 5 gateways on word who got zw700 and most of them is not for sell

     

    For Us important is to have stability - new chip always bring a problems, when product is polished then we will use it.

    BTW to change zw500 on zw700 you new completely new z-wave engine based on zip.

     

    About z-wave LR I wait when we will get more info about that because is now more marketing, I hope when we will get samples it will confirm some of them. (what chip zw700 or new one, what about power energy, is that will have backcompability etc..

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    3 hours ago, jwi said:

    I think that LR will be realized with the 700 chip. It is possible that the RX/TX performance

    is increased, or more and better antennas, or more frequencies or ???

    In any case, it would have been better if Fibaro had brought out the HC3 with a 700 chip.

     

    HC3 is using PA (and LNA in RX path), giving you (with the antenna used in HC3) +14dBm - which is btw max in EU (or +9dBm on channel 0) giving you 800 outdoor (till 1.1km) and 120 indoor (till 160m) on the paper (calculated with some realistic value and not max, so -87dBm RX level, plus 3dBm from LNA/SAW combination). The best range would be of course with 9.6k and channel 1, which for sure in real world is still 400m outdoor -> between HC3 and device with same RX/TX (which is actually the reason why range is lower in real world, especially indoor, with the way how antennas are used and the device RX/TX).

     

    So yes, with better filter/some LNA inside to increase RX sens. and max. 14dBm TX in EU no problem to use zw700 (or 500 with PA/LNA, like Fibaro did in HC3) it's perfectly possible to create LR zwave-like system even today (at least on paper). Of course Z-wave LR is more than just range extension.

     

    There was yesterday online silabs conference, i think the information is now offline available to download, they promised to talk about LR as well (haven't attended, so no idea).

    Edited by tinman
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    2000 devices on how many radio channels at 868 MHz and a self organizing mesh? LMFAO. Marketing blurb. It is difficult enough to manage 100-200 nodes with current tech... We all want backwards compatibility but there is always some (hidden) cost or compromise. For example, in EU we have 2 frequencies, but one is used for older devices and does either 9.6 or 40k and the other channel does 100k (signal bit rate, real performance is much lower, you have to look  at packets/s and packet size as well.). If Z-Wave Plus had dropped compatibility with older devices, which would be totally unacceptable because you wont your modules to keep working for 10 years, there would have been 2 x 100k channels now. Big difference, because you could have 2 relatively fast networks without interference for example. Even when you do not have any old device, the low speed channel is not available to do 100k. That's what I mean by (hidden) cost or compromise. Let's find out what the Z-Wave LR compromises are. But you know, the message is clear: "hey guys, you do not have to leave the Z-Wave eco system because you think it cannot do big networks like Zigbee  (or LORA or ...)". BTW I can say nice things about Z-Wave too, and bad things about Zigbee, but I hate marketing bs.

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  • 41 minutes ago, SmartHomeEddy said:

    OK, so let's make all marketing promises of the current HC3 platform reality 😀

     

    Dreamer 😉, at the current rate of development, this will take years.

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    short o-ton from Dr. Zwave from yestardays presentation -> "Zwave LR can use any zw700, the functionality can be added via OTA, the range extension is due to changed modulation and inscreased power, Zwave LR devices stays zwave plus compatible, Zwave LR can use star architecture therefore for far sensors/actors, it will check if information has been sent/recieved"

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    Thanks @tinman, you happen to have a link to that session? I got lost on the Silabs web site ;)

     

    For me,  Z-Wave LR will only exists when I get a Zniffer firmware that runs on the ZW700 dongle and supports LR :D 

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    1 hour ago, petergebruers said:

    Thanks @tinman, you happen to have a link to that session? I got lost on the Silabs web site ;)

     

    For me,  Z-Wave LR will only exists when I get a Zniffer firmware that runs on the ZW700 dongle and supports LR :D 

     

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    interessting is as well 

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     (z/ip not mandatory anymore for 700 controllers)

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  • On 9/10/2020 at 3:19 PM, tinman said:

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    On 9/10/2020 at 12:48 PM,

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    said:

    I think that LR will be realized with the 700 chip. It is possible that the RX/TX performance

    is increased, or more and better antennas, or more frequencies or ???

     

    9 hours ago, tinman said:

    short o-ton from Dr. Zwave from yestardays presentation -> "Zwave LR can use any zw700, the functionality can be added via OTA, the range extension is due to changed modulation and inscreased power, Zwave LR devices stays zwave plus compatible, Zwave LR can use star architecture therefore for far sensors/actors, it will check if information has been sent/recieved"

     

    So I wasn't entirely wrong with my guess.
    But since there is no reasonable gateway based on a 700 chip so far,

    this dream will only come true in a few years. So I will continue to hope that the HC3 becomes as stable as the HC2.

     

    Also interesting 

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