Constant voltage as a Smart Implant input (from gate opener)

[Simon W 0]

I have a gate motor that has a "Gate open indicator" that outputs 24V to drive an optional indicator bulb. By default it flashes while opening/closing, but it can alternately be set to solid on with the gate open or closed. I'll have it set to be active (i.e. 24V active) on gate open. I want to connect the gate open output to the Smart Implant as an input so I can make my ZWave network 'aware' of the gate status.

 

Firstly I assume that 24V is too high, so I will need to step down to 3.3V with a switching regulator.

Secondly how I would connect that as an input for the smart implant - is it just a connection across GND and IN1 at <10V required? I think it is as described in the Smart Implant manual as a "2-wire 0-10V sensor" in section 4.5? It mentions in the manual that this setup requires a pull-up resistor but doesn't show it on the diagram - what else is required? The manual also says in 4.5 for this setup "the 12V supply is required for these type of sensors" - not sure how that is different from the device's normal power requirement? 

 

Thanks

[Flash 103]

I would use the 24V for powering the SmartImplant. If it's DC power.

Connect the open signal from the gate motor to a magnetic contactor or a solid state relais.

Then use a potential free NO contact to connect IN1/IN2 to GND. This tells the Smart Implant the grage door is open.

[Simon W 0]

2 hours ago, Flash said:

I would use the 24V for powering the SmartImplant. If it's DC power.

Connect the open signal from the gate motor to a magnetic contactor or a solid state relais.

Then use a potential free NO contact to connect IN1/IN2 to GND. This tells the Smart Implant the grage door is open.

 

Thanks for the comment. 

 

My title was possibly misleading - the 24V is not constant as in all the time... it is supplied *either* when the gate is open *or* when it is closed (configurable), not all the time. So I cannot use it to supply DC for the Smart Implant. I'm not going to have any issue getting power to it though, so that is not an issue for this question.

I could possibly use the 24V to trigger a relay, I'll investigate that as an option.

 

However, I'd still like to understand how use a non-potential free input as a <10V input per my question, where one state is 0V and the other state is (e.g.) 3.3V.

 

If anyone can comment on the use of a steady-state <10V voltage on a Smart Implant input that would be appreciated.

Edited October 24, 2021 by Simon W

[akatar 208]

I am not sure what you are trying to accomplish

 

But if you want to know if the gate is opening/closing and you want the status then a 24 relais is enough to make it visible if the gate is moving.

You state that there is 24volt if the gate is moving. so 1 input for "moving gate"

and use a the scond input for gate closed -> something like this: 

Please login or register to see this link.

only the read contact afcourse

or use a second read contact for gate is open or closed

[Flash 103]

8 hours ago, Simon W said:

If anyone can comment on the use of a steady-state <10V voltage on a Smart Implant input that would be appreciated

 

AFAIK if you connect a analog signal to the implant you get a reading from 0-10V.

[Simon W 0]

9 hours ago, akatar said:

I am not sure what you are trying to accomplish

 

But if you want to know if the gate is opening/closing and you want the status then a 24 relais is enough to make it visible if the gate is moving.

You state that there is 24volt if the gate is moving. so 1 input for "moving gate"

and use a the scond input for gate closed -> something like this: 

Please login or register to see this link.

only the read contact afcourse

or use a second read contact for gate is open or closed

 

Thank you @akatar. My very first line has what I am trying to accomplish - "make my ZWave network 'aware' of the gate status". I didn't say anything about wanting to know when the gate was opening or closing, but can understand how that could have been interpreted. I want to know, via ZWave, if the gate is open (doesn't matter if opening, closing or open stationary - it is 'open' i.e. there is a gap) or closed. The motor's "open gate indicator" will do that by raising 24V across two terminals at any point when not closed, and 0V at any other time. I want to connect that motor 24V output to one of a Smart Implant's inputs (after stepping down to a suitable level to be < 10V), and am assuming that will work per manual's section 4.5. Just one input, not multiple. The link was interesting, thank you. A magnetic sensor won't tell me anything the motor's open gate indicator output doesn't already. 

 

1 hour ago, Flash said:

 

AFAIK if you connect a analog signal to the implant you get a reading from 0-10V.

 

Thanks @Flash that makes sense. Doing more reading after your first post, I can see two ways of using the motor's open gate indicator output - I could feed the 24V to a relay and use the relay's NO or NC output as a potential-free Smart Implant input; or I could step the output down to < 10V and use as an analog Smart Implant input. 

[akatar 208]

@Simon W

just to be clear

the terminals has always 24v (ac or dc) if he gate is open and always 0 volt as the gate is closed? ifso:

buy a 24v relais (ac or dc) connect it through relais to the implant, set the implant to door and you see door open or closed in youre hc2/hc3

 

[Simon W 0]

11 minutes ago, akatar said:

@Simon W

just to be clear

the terminals has always 24v (ac or dc) if he gate is open and always 0 volt as the gate is closed? ifso:

buy a 24v relais (ac or dc) connect it through relais to the implant, set the implant to door and you see door open or closed in youre hc2/hc3

 

 

Yes, that's the first option I note above - "feed to a relay and use the relay's NO or NC output as a potential-free Smart Implant input". I will likely pick up a relay to do that option but I may also buy a voltage regulator and try the analog input option - would be useful to see how the Implant handles that.

[Tim__ 125]

Because the implant imput draws negligible current,  Instead of a voltage regulator you could use a simple 2 resistor voltage divider to step down the voltage.

[Martin_N 153]

@Simon W

Hi,..
if you want to experiment with analog inputs on SI, read this thread, where we discussed with other enthusiasts.

Please login or register to see this link.

 

Personally, I advise you just like the others, use the relay to convert the 24V voltage state to a potential-free contact and use the inputs on the SI in binary mode.
The point is that in the case of an analog value, you have to read this value on HC3, compare it with a value and then make it a binary state (gate open / closed).
So it is an unnecessarily complicated solution and you may encounter delays in reading the values, see my experiments in the attached thread.
The added value of binary inputs to SI is that you can directly start scenes when activating them (I can imagine a situation where you use it - for example, when the gate is opened, the driveway lights up ...)

[TerjeW 0]

@SimonW your setup sounds very similar to mine. Are you by any chance trying to control a Hørmann garage opener, perhaps the Promatic 3 model? If so, I would be very interested in hearing what you ended up with. I have my Smart Implant connected to the opener, and can use it to trigger the opening and closing of the gate, but so far it is not very reliable. I have experimented with different auto off delays, and that seems to help a bit, but I still cannot get it to work 100%.

 

I am fetching 24v to power the Smart Implant from 2 of the pins used to drive an external wireless receiver on the Promatic, so I wonder if that might be the problem.