HELP: Need alternative to HC2

[goran 9]

Besides, if the motion sensor actually still shows up as a motion sensor rather than a temperature sensor, Robert should consider himself lucky.

that's only a problem with hc2 and 3.x firmware.

i am using the pir with hs3 and still works as a motion sensor

And what branch is the latest "stable" version again? The one we're recommended by Fibaro to use? When 4.x is released, about 3 years from now, it may be fixed but we will get tons of other bugs instead. So don't tell me it's "only" broken in the latest stable version. This is one of the many bugs that Fibaro should have taken care of a long long time ago. The bug should only be considered as fixed when the fix is implemented in the stable firmware branch.

[akatar 208]

i wrote: 3.x fimware, so the whole version 3 (all of them)

so not only the latest "stable"

[deanrparry 19]

As eager as I am for a STABLE! Fibaro 4.x release I have to pop this one in!

I have just tested my new ZWave.me 5th Gen USB stick!

WOW!

My pi is in the loft and i am 2 floors below with 2 solid walls in the way and just installed a fibaro motion sensor with ease!

And just check the node data and it has routed very nicely! £20 pi and £15 stick with free software!

[GlennNZ 0]

After some ongoing frustrating regarding a few issues over the year (most of which involvement of support have fixed) I quietly came to an enough is enough and have completely moved my system to indigodomo and thought would detail the results here. (Z-wave network is about 80 fibaro relays and dimmers, with few aeon S2 plugs, motion sensors, aeon energy monitoring)

{My HC2 issues through the year - intermittent slow response to devices taking minutes (Z-wave network issue, polling etc not changed), Dead devices (running dead device script – helps), HC2 not primary controller error (now twice – requires Support to SSH into box to fix), Lack of energy meter support (bugzilla ticket closed Jan 2014 – as resolved in x4.00 – still I believe unresolved as 4.021!) }

Anyway – I looked into options and indigodomo seemed like a reasonable option, however was put off as don’t have a mac/never used mac’s – although have a ton of other iOS devices and thought of excluding/including my whole network (most of which are fibaro dimmers and relays) did not sound like fun. None-the-less something tipped me over the edge and I splurged on a mac-mini and Z-stick and Indigo software licence.

First impressions:

- Physical size of mac-mini is almost the same as fibaro box, and quite physically similar. Although huge benefit of ‘property OS’/Proper Computer is not to be understated – easy integration with UPS etc – will shutdown/restart as a proper computer should, Build in Wifi(AC) can now put anywhere. With full system running haven’t seen CPU over 10%.

- Runs cool – much cooler than HC2 – which at times was egg-cooking hot.

- Plugins via python on indigodomo– even prior to Z-wave network change had sorted on geolocation using geofency (ios) and indigodomo Beacon plugin. Soon to use some estimate to trigger various inhouse behaviour – haven’t figured out logic of what I want as yet.

- Documentation – wow; Seriously have a look at this page – please have a look - as the contrast is quite considerable , particularly thinking of the able developers on the Fibaro site.

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Regarding developing a python based plugin – far and away more complete than anything I seen from Fibaro.

- Control Pages(!) Somehow was quite late at realising what these are.

I think in retrospect this was the previous unknown feature that made me push the change button.

Basically something I and others had to restore to running our own webserver and using Java/or Curl/and server-side php to communicate with HC2 to achieve.

Setting up your own pages of information – including easily adding IP Camera H264 streams (! Yah finally) in whatever layout , fancy, size etc needed. Accessed through web-browser most usefully or indigo touch (outdated, but actively being updated currently)

see here for some examples:

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- Plugins in Indigo using

RFXCOM – wow – Weather stations integrated without problem (had previously used fibaro door sensor temp with long run to get pool temp – but was constantly having battery issues) Now mine and neighbours Oregon Scientific stations are easily recognised and updated every few minutes.

Beacon – Geolocation via iOS. GeoFency seems to work the best. (Could be easily integrated with HC2 as well via Http call to update variable) Have not noticed battery issues on both 5S and 4S Iphones.

Timers – simple, works well

IR Cache – Send Global Cache IR Commands.

VeraBridge – for lock control via separate Vera – working well

ThingSpeak – upload temps to internet for further use.

iMessage plugin – to send iMessages/Photo when someone arrives home (via Macs own iMessage account – previously unconsidered positive to Mac OS)

Issues with Indigo

- No backup for Z-Wave Stick2 – the stick holds the devices, not indigo. Given the stick lacks the ‘installer’ firmware its not able to backup and restore to new network.

Multiple posts across multiple controller forums confirm this. Interestingly there was AeonLabs software posted on link attached that was for backup/restore of Z-Stick2 – however crashes on running with/without stick. I have emailed AeonLabs support person for comment/and source ideally to review but have heard nothing.

Clearly this may be major issue – if Z-Stick fails need to replace Z-Stick2 and then reinclude everything to network,

Newer Z-wave.me stick appears to have backup/restore features but no battery so devices cannot be added next to device which is needed for indigo currently.

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- link to software – if anyone gets this working please let me and rest of world know!

- Not able to associate switch 2 of fibaro relays to other device (no multi-endpoint associations) This did confuse me for a while – but basically for me is a non-issue. It is very possible to associated switch 2 of both relay and dimmer with other devices. It is not possible (I believe) to have the 2nd switch of the relay controlled by an another associated device.

- No Lock support.

see

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Although do admit that Vera Bridge software works very well – and controls lock well so not an major, or issue at all for me. Does involve having a Vera around – but I suspect many of us do.

Anyhow – after playing around with the non-Zwave aspects, plugins etc for a while – made the move and excluded my 100 or so devices and included them into indigo few at a time. Its useful to note that any controller can exclude devices (so don’t have to delete them on HC2 – although did so for the majority)

So far – so good.

The device database support seems very good – Siren, Aeon Switches etc. A lot of these devices were recognised by HC2 but may have been cause of network/HC2 issues. It’s interesting to note the indigodomo developer’s comment on the Aeon S2 Switch – updating power every few seconds swamping the network on its factory default settings. (whether this added issues to old HC2 install unsure) Aeon Labs 3 clamp powerclamp – which my bugzilla ticket was closed in beginning of 2014 as fixed in 4.00x – works well – updating every 5 minutes or so.

Basically once installed – set up, schedules (build in), triggers and motion sensing, timer plugin very useful for multiple motion based timers (similar to lua scripts used to run) so timer updated with movement (to avoid multiple z-wave commands if device already on)

In all – took a day, and largest part was including, excluding devices. Setting up triggers etc very easy and did not take long at all. Also have continued for moment with own webserver pages – and fairly simple process to change server-php to send commands to indigodomo API instead. (although couple of curl auth commands needed to be added)

Anyway – does the Z-wave network respond?

Wow.

Its Responsive.

Far away devices – which always caused the HC2 to hang, & nothing to work for a period – work well.

In all – it brings back the excitment of home automation – were things work or if they don’t these a reason why. Since I have added new devices and further automations – something I had been reluctant to do in HC2 as everytime I changed something – something else failed/didn’t work.

Now I have the old excitement back and are looking a new aspects (iBeacons inside triggers amongst them) but also have set up control pages for main tablets(with floor maps for lights – WAF level very high), and have started a few python scripts

In all now a couple of weeks later – the move over to indigodomo has been very successful and my HC2 is sitting unplugged on a shelf.

Clearly whilst 4.something is anticipated and hopefully solves a lot of issues – I have already found an mainly issue free solution!

Best of luck.

Glenn

[wienog 107]

Clearly whilst 4.something is anticipated and hopefully solves a lot of issues – I have already found an mainly issue free solution!

Best of luck.

Glenn

Glenn,

I understand your frustrations with Fibaro, many of us share them.

Still I'm surprised every time someone actually takes the step to leave Fibaro and go to an other system.

For me, Fibaro is my seventh domotics controller I use. Before I worked with E-domotica, Domoticz, M-Control, Indigo, Homeseer HS3 and a few others.

And for me Fibaro is performing better than all my previous systems, although far from perfect, I agree.

I have 208 devices and 212 scenes controlling and regulating heating, airco, moisture, blinds, multimedia, lighting and alarm in my house. All these have been working almost flawlessly for more than 8 months now.

Although I do need to juggle here and there a bit after every upgrade to a new Beta.

My main frustrations are with the geolocation that does not work at all for me and other 'advertised' features that nobody here can get to work.

Still if you would ask me right now to go back to one of the other controllers I mentioned I wouldn't consider that.

Domotics (still) is residing in a geek-zone and will probably never be perfect, not even close, one of the reasons Fibaro made a huge mistake comparing the company with Apple as the Fibaro products are all BUT usable 'out-of-the-box'.

Anyway keep us posted about your Indigo-experiences, very interesting !

[GlennNZ 0]

Each to his own.

I couldn't image running that number of scenes (although have around 100-130 devices) as on Hc2 would randomly fail - devices/lights would be on all night (as dead node at time of scene) Twice a day lights would come on 3-4 minutes later than motion detection. Took a while but found was not z-wave problem as associated devices worked immediately during this time, it was a Hc2 issue.

I agree - this is geek-zone level though - with generally low WTF, but the randomness of the errors and failures was what got to me. If there was a level of access where it could be understood - fine - but there wasn't.

Sorry to hear about 4.030 - sound likes much of the same.

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I would add there are other options - holding me back sooner was the pain of moving devices - only took 4 hours or so (even unscrewing wall fittings) the rest was very straight forward. ($ aside but this isn't a cheap hobby)

At the indigo end here - All continues to go well - as I note above - the old excitement is back (rather than the fear something new will fail) and I have added devices, SMS control (when my wife and I are away - the server iMsg's us and lets us know 12 lights/devices are still on and would we like to turn them off - a simple Yes and off they go!)

Best of luck

Glenn

[MrMKHR 1]

I hope to get some feedback on this - especially from some of the guys that are involved with domotics for some time now. maybe I should have started a different topic for it...

I renovated part of my flat and installed zwave stuff because I was able to retrofit the components. Now I'm in the planning to build a new house.

As the HC2 is completely unreliable for me and some people still claim that it's one of the better zwave controllers, the following question arises:

Should I move away from zwave to some wire-setup?

I still want to try indigo before deciding. I can justify bugs here and there. I can live with a few workarounds. I certanly can't live with the tons of regressions and uncertanty that fibaro provides.

Basically, I guess I need a solution that will work once it's set up. I'm happy to invest time when making a new purchase, adding a new device or whatever. I'm unhappy to invest time at random points (even without any update) because of dead nodes, scenes not working or false positives.

So, does anyone have hands-on experience as well with wire based stuff AND fibaro (maybe even indigo) and write down his opinion?

[marecki_0luk1 23]

MrMKHR, yes you should look at KNX, Loxcone or many more. I very regret the decision in my new home, but I don't have wiring.

[Produno 15]

yup, wish i had have pre wired for a wired system. I renovated my own home this year including all new electrics! I really wish i had have pulled an extra cable to every point in the house

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[michael 0]

With KNX (green wires) you need to buy an expensive software just to configure and set parameters.

If the Home Center Software doesn't work I'll give the upcoming Z-Wave Plus RaZberry a try.

[U5tabil 2]

Im getting confused of everything. The fact that this is v4 and there is this many basic problems is disturbing to say the least. I got my Fibaro in late december 2014, thinking this was going to be it. I didnt know i needed to go this deep to get stuff working. Like the box layout of scenes, good idea but it just doesnt work. writing in pure LUA, well thats what you need to do, to get it working a little. But im very afraid as my setup is still small. investing in more modules ending up with bunch of dead nodes, that freaks me out. And today i picked up a brand new fibaro motion sensor at the mail office, just to find out that in v4 its bugged and you cant configure it at all, your stuck with basic cionfig.

If fibaro as much as mention another new feature instead of really devoting themself to solving and making their product rock solid i will seriously consider changing system before i spend more time learning something that is doomed eventually.

I just start to regreet that i didn't search forums more carefully before i decided what to go for. Because this forum is full of angry users.

[ Added: 2015-01-07, 22:23 ]

Has anyone used HomeSeer?

Since i have a windows server this sounds good.

also they won home automation 2014

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[KristianO 15]

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[akatar 208]

yeah, i use homeseer 2 and 3

[U5tabil 2]

yeah, i use homeseer 2 and 3

And how is that compared to HC2?

[akatar 208]

hc3 is stable and more flexible then fibaro

and zwave is a plugin within hs3, so updating zwave is done in a few seconds

[U5tabil 2]

hc3 is stable and more flexible then fibaro

and zwave is a plugin within hs3, so updating zwave is done in a few seconds

i would like to know more about this. can i make really complex scenes? is there a netatmo plugin? XBMC plugin that i can control light out from playing movie, pausing etc?

[akatar 208]

you can make complex scenes etc (and scripting)

for plugins:

www.homeseer.com you can use the software free for 30 days

www.domoticaforum.eu for info and plugins (frtitzbox, plugwise etc)

for touchscreens, iphone, ipads etc, you can make youre own screens

[Guest mhn]

I am a Homeseer user too. But I don't think this is the right forum for Homeseer promotion.

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/emoticons/default_icon_smile.gif" alt=":-)" /> Maybe Domoticaforum or Homeseer forum?

Regards

Morten

[richo 4]

you can make complex scenes etc (and scripting)

for plugins:

www.homeseer.com you can use the software free for 30 days

www.domoticaforum.eu for info and plugins (frtitzbox, plugwise etc)

for touchscreens, iphone, ipads etc, you can make youre own screens

To be honest I would prefer to spend these money on used Mac Mini plus Indigo (which is a fully blown computer with best OS on the planet) then on a dedicated box.

Other then that I'm sure HS is a good and capable product.

[ruslebiff 0]

what about the wink hub? looks great. supports many things including z-wave.

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