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CO Sensor placement! [ read this !! ]


D-Vine
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Question

After I bought the CO Sensors of Fibaro I saw the documentation and the requirements of placement are incomplete.

The only picture is the one of 1.5m from the floor that's it. But this is not the only requirement of placing.  

 

Please read the following instructions (dutch) of the fire department netherlands.

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translate EN >> 

 

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In a room with a gas appliance (possible CO source)
On the ceiling
- At a horizontal distance between 1 and 3 meters from the CO source.
-Central to space.
- At least 30 centimeters from surrounding walls.
- Not next to existing air intakes or
air outlets or other objects to it
ceiling.

 

bw-ned-co-bronruimte-schuinplafond.jpg

With a sloping ceiling

- At a horizontal distance between 1 and 3 meters from the CO source.
- Place the detector on the high side of the sloping ceiling.

 

bw-ned-co-slaapkamer.jpg

In a room without a gas appliance Bedrooms
At (minimum) breathing height
- Breathing height is the bedroom in bedrooms altitude on which one sleeps.
- Not next to air intakes or air outlets.
- Not behind objects such as curtains and cabinets.

 

bw-ned-co-overige-ruimte.jpg

Other spaces
At (minimum) breathing height

- Depending on activities in the room corresponds to breath altitude sitting or walking height.
- Not next to air intakes or air outlets.
- Not behind objects such as curtains and cabinets.

 

bw-ned-co-hoe-het-niet-moet.jpg

Never place the CO alarm here
- Not next to air intakes or air outlets

- Not behind objects such as curtains and cabinets.

 

 

And see instruction video english for complete instructions of placements.

 

a few years ago, 2 girls died in my village because of carbon monoxide poisonings. After this there was nationwide an action for the purchase and proper placement of the detectors supported by fire brigade the Netherlands

 

 

Fibaro I recommend that you adjust the documentation a.s.a.p! 

 

 

Edited by D-Vine
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Hi @D-Vine!

 

36 minutes ago, D-Vine said:

After I bought the CO Sensors of Fibaro I saw the documentation and the requirements of placement are incomplete.

The only picture is the one of 1.5m from the floor that's it. But this is not the only requirement of placing.  

 

We put our most general recommendation about the placement of CO sensor, the most universal.

 

Sometimes official regulation differs from one country to another and an in-box manual should be as detailed and universal at the same time as possible.

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  • 3 minutes ago, I.Srodka said:

    Hi @D-Vine!

     

     

    We put our most general recommendation about the placement of CO sensor, the most universal.

     

    Sometimes official regulation differs from one country to another and an in-box manual should be as detailed and universal at the same time as possible.

     

    Hi Srodka thanks for fast reply.

    I really disagree with answer. I also put a international company in the post with the same recommandations as the dutch. I'm aware that it should be universal but the detailed information is not there!

    -The 30 centimeters from surrounding walls is international placement requirement 

    - The horizontal distance between 1 and 3 meters from the CO source is a international requirement

    Never place the CO alarm here section is a international requirement

    (if people don't there is bat airflow sensor won't work properly )

     

    The place of installation is good yes but not in a CO source room!

     

    The manual has 134 pages so other 5 can be added easily. 

     

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    Hi again @D-Vine!

     

    Thank you for your suggestions.

     

    More detailed information maybe could be added.

     

    However, you have to admit that there are more info about the placement on our web version of manuals:

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    Quote

    Installation notes

    • The device should be installed below the ceiling level.
    • The device should be installed on the wall, at least 30 cm (1 ft) away from the corners.
    • The device should not be installed: in a bathroom, next to heat sources, within range of kids, obstructed from possible carbon monoxide sources, in direct sunlight.
    • The device should be installed by a qualified installer.
    • Do not paint the device.
    • The device should be cleaned with a slightly damp cloth or moistened tissue.

     

    or in the full english manual:

    Please login or register to see this link.

     

     

     

    10 minutes ago, Orgli said:

    Please, keep in mind that CO is heavier than O2. That means CO "lays" on the ground and "floods" up with increasing concentration (chemical).

    That's why the images suggest it should be attached to a wall not the ceiling.

     

    Even the icon for this forum looks as if it hangs and Smoke Sensor is upside down as if it is attached to a ceiling.

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    9 minutes ago, Orgli said:

    Please, keep in mind that CO is heavier than O2. That means CO "lays" on the ground and "floods" up with increasing concentration (chemical).

     

    No, it does not "lay on the ground", it mixes with air! But I understand your confusion, you are talking about CO2. CO is not CO2!

     

    CO = Carbon Monoxide has a density of about 97% that of air (normal room temperature). The difference is small and air turbulence (due to temperature difference) mixes the gasses.

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    @petergebruers: Yes, you are completely right - we have to differ between CO and CO2 - both toxic but with different behavior. And yes, it's the CO2 that accumulates on the ground. Sorry for the confusion.

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  • 1 hour ago, petergebruers said:

     

    No, it does not "lay on the ground", it mixes with air! But I understand your confusion, you are talking about CO2. CO is not CO2!

     

    CO = Carbon Monoxide has a density of about 97% that of air (normal room temperature). The difference is small and air turbulence (due to temperature difference) mixes the gasses.

    Agree with this... people make mistakes about this
     

    I was aware of the internet site but the manual with the CO sensor is incomplete.  Also think with pictures added it on site and manual is more clear

    Hope that fibaro with make a new video of the CO sensor installation, with complete instructions like the video I added.

     

    Besides this I want people to know the danger of this "killer" and the importance of placing it in a good way.

    Ask around you with friends or family where should you place a CO sensor...  8 out of 10 doesn't even know it or would place it in wrong way.

     

    With some years of experience in the fire detection sector I know the importance of placements of (smoke) sensors and with that the interest of placing CO sensors in good way.

    But I want Fibaro to make the documentation complete and give better information and awareness of the CO sensor

     

    The Fibaro CO sensors are great let me be clear about that!

     

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    7 minutes ago, Orgli said:

    @petergebruers: Yes, you are completely right - we have to differ between CO and CO2 - both toxic but with different behavior. And yes, it's the CO2 that accumulates on the ground. Sorry for the confusion.

     

    No problem... You might want to edit your original post to avoid confusion in a topic that was dedicated, especially, to the correct installation of a CO = carbon monoxide sensor... I fully agree carbon dioxide = CO2 is toxic if it displaces air... Server rooms often use carbon dioxide fire extinguishers and you have to leave them immediately if they get activated! BTW the Fibaro CO sensor does not detect carbon dioxide = CO2 , only carbon monoxide = CO and that is to be expected from this kind of sensor. I do own two CO2 sensors for air quality monitoring. It is a totally different sensor!

     

    @D-Vine great posts, I agree, this deserves some attention. Thanks!

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    2 minutes ago, petergebruers said:

    @D-Vine great posts, I agree, this deserves some attention. Thanks!

     

    So I would like to assure you that the attention has been raised.

     

    You're welcome to continue your discussion and test the new forum feature and vote for the best answer, and vote in general (with the buttons on the left).

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  • 42 minutes ago, petergebruers said:

     

    @D-Vine great posts, I agree, this deserves some attention. Thanks!

     

    36 minutes ago, I.Srodka said:

     

    So I would like to assure you that the attention has been raised.

     

    You're welcome to continue your discussion and test the new forum feature and vote for the best answer, and vote in general (with the buttons on the left).

     

    Thanks!
    Looking forward to see the documentation and (video) instruction improvements 

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    Placing CO sensors vs. CO2 / multi sensors:

    Please, keep in mind that CO2 is heavier than O2. That means CO2 "lays" on the ground and "floods" up with increasing concentration (chemical).

    At home I use three different sensors CO / CO2 / gas, placed in different heights.
    [On duty we wear a CO (H2S) sensor from Draeger, placed on our jacket.]

    Edited by Orgli
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